Tuesday, September 6, 2011

Chasing a Tangent: The Crazy List Idea

Well, I got one response to my call for list help, though I got quite a bit of good information and discussion on why to use or not use Ironclads.  You can see a proposed list in the comments section of my original post, Chasing a Tangent.  Thanks Student Teacher!  You can see the Ironclad discussion in my post, Ironclads: Any Good?  Thanks to those guys for offering their input. 

So, here are the things I have learned about a dread heavy list from past experience. You may get a lot of this from reading my other posts mentioned above, but I am going to consolidate them here.

Courtesy of Strangelooper's Cangames 2011 Report
To begin with, the list will obviously need a Master of the Forge.  He is the only way to get more than 3 Dreadnoughts.  Since he comes stock with a 2+ save (not much without an invul, but not bad either) and 2 power fist attacks, I generally leave him cheap with just a bolter.  100pt. done.

Then the choices start.  How do we want to kit out the Dreadnoughts?  Well, I have come to the conclusion that my dread list is going to only have 5 dreads.  I need a solid combat threat and the best one Codex Marines have comes in the form of thunder hammer/storm shield terminators, but more on them later.  Thus, I have a spot for a maximum of 5 dreads.  Cool.  I generally split my dreads into two categories in my head, ranged support and close combat/melta support.  The hands down winner for the ranged support is the jack-of-all-trades, Rifleman Dread.  Two twin-linked autocannons putting down 4 S7 AP4 shots is great and can handle light mech and infantry with a fair amount of ease.  Since I am going to have other ranged option for support, this is where I will make my dividing line.  Two Riflemen will fill my elite slots beside my terminators.  This leaves 3 spots for dreads left.

After hashing it out, playtesting, and finding out what works, I realized that I need dreads that can get close in quickly, pop mech or toast infantry with equal ease, and provide enough threat in order to make my opponent make some mistakes while I close on them.  With that in mind, I have come up with two possible options: the simple MM/DCCW vanilla Dreadnought or an Ironclad with meltagun and heavy flamer.  The best delivery method for each is a drop pod as with three dreadnoughts in drop pods, I have two coming down turn 1 and the third hopefully coming down soon after.  This gets them across the board quickly and puts them in threat range.

As discussed in earlier posts, the Ironclad looks like it should win hands down with AV13 on front and sides, two DCCWs, extra armor, and other nice upgrades.  As stated though, my issue with this guy is his range.  With no solid weapon option for popping mech with a range over 12" (meltagun), he has to stay in close and if he doesn't pop armor, he is more than likely going to be avoided by vehicles moving flat out to stay away from him.  I have seen this done several times. Of course, he can take HK missiles, but I haven't had much luck with those in my experience.  Another note to mention is that at close range, AV13 and AV12 will die to melta with equal ease. 

The vanilla dread though, has a multi-melta which gives a significant range boost thus keeping most units within threat range.  On top of that, it can take the heavy flamer on it's DCCW which significantly boosts its ability to take on squads in close combat since it loses an attack versus the Ironclad. No biggie though.  On top of that, a vanilla dread saves me 50pts. versus an Ironclad with HK missiles, totaling 150pt. saved across the three remaining slots.  Not bad at all. 

So, that leaves me with the following:

MotF-100pt.
Rifleman-125pt.
Rifleman-125pt.

Dreadnought-MM/DCCW with heavy flamer, pod-150pt.
Dreadnought-MM/DCCW with heavy flamer, pod-150pt.
Dreadnought-MM/DCCW with heavy flamer, pod-150pt.

That's 800pt. which gives me 1200pt to play with.  As mentioned I want a solid combat threat and the best one I have is hammernators.  To make best use of the remaining slot, I think taking a squad of 10 for 400pt is solid.  That gives me the ability to have one nasty unit or two solid threats via combat squadding. 

I am now left with the options for filling my troop choices.  As mentioned earlier, I really need some more ranged firepower, so though it may seem spare I am going to go with 3 min sized tac squads in las/plas razorbacks.  That gives me 3 more heavy weapons platforms and three scoring options, though they are a bit skinny with only 15 marines to provide objective support.  To bolster that a bit, I will add a home camping squad of scouts with sniper rifles, missile launcher, and camo cloaks. The MotF can bolster a building for them to be in with a 2+ cover and he can join the unit to help babysit them/stay safe.  If I keep my rifleman dreads close, he can zoom over and affect repairs if they become damaged. That brings us to the following:

MotF-100pt.

Rifleman-125pt.
Rifleman-125pt.
10 Terminators-thunder hammer/storm shield- 400pt

5 marines- las/plas razorback-165pt.
5 marines- las/plas razorback-165pt.
5 marines- las/plas razorback-165pt.
5 scouts- sniper rifles, missile launcher, camo cloaks- 100pt.

Dreadnought-MM/DCCW with heavy flamer, pod-150pt.
Dreadnought-MM/DCCW with heavy flamer, pod-150pt.
Dreadnought-MM/DCCW with heavy flamer, pod-150pt.

This gives me exactly 205pt to play with.  I guess technically, I should put that into another troop choice or triple landspeeders, but here is where I think I can add a twist to really create pressure on my opponent: Kayvaan Shrike.  Yep.  Add Shrike and all of a sudden I have fleet terminators, of which all or one combat squad can infiltrate if Shrike joins them.  This makes them a very solid, aggressive combat threat that will be hard to remove.  This is where I imagine this army doing well.  The terminators infiltrate and move aggressively forward.  The first two dreads drop in on the flanks or behind my opponent and start to pop mech with my ranged support.  These units form my noose.  As it tightens, my opponent should hopefully become paralyzed in how it deals with the incoming threats allowing me to slowly move up my razorback to claim objectives.  The dreads, pods, and terminators will contest objectives on my opponents' side of the board and hopefully net some solid KP in those type of missions. 

So, the final list as I see it:

MotF-100pt.
Kayvaan Shrike- 195pt.

Rifleman-125pt.
Rifleman-125pt.
10 Terminators-thunder hammer/storm shield- 400pt

5 marines- las/plas razorback-165pt.
5 marines- las/plas razorback-165pt.
5 marines- las/plas razorback-165pt.
5 scouts- sniper rifles, missile launcher, camo cloaks- 100pt.

Dreadnought-MM/DCCW with heavy flamer, pod-150pt.
Dreadnought-MM/DCCW with heavy flamer, pod-150pt.
Dreadnought-MM/DCCW with heavy flamer, pod-150pt.

This comes in at 1990pt. with 4 scoring options, solid combat threat along with the ability to open up transports with a fair amount of ease.  I can add searchlights to dreads or a combi-weapon to a sarge to fill out the last 10pt. In my head it works.  In reality, it may not.  I see two potential fixes if it doesn't work.  1 would be to drop Shrike for Vulkan to make the army a bit more reliable (dreads and terminators anyway), or drop Shrike for three speeders, probably multi-melta/heavy flamer to help with opening up armor. 

So there you have it, my crazy dread heavy idea.  What do you think?  Feel free to tear it apart if you like.  I am not attached to it as I haven't had an opportunity to actually play it yet.  It is just an army that I think would work well and provide a solid threat.  I am interested to get feedback. So, let a rip!


Other useful articles:
Strictly Average
For kicks
Heading in another direction
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2 comments:

Warflake said...

Well in my opinion that sounds really fun. Lot's of shootyness. I like shootyness. Vulkan may well be a good idea though with this list. It would add serious threat to it.

Stokie_Rich said...

Looks good to me, as you've pointed out it lacks scoring bodies but then it seems a fun list to play rather than a super competitive one.

Second the idea about Vulcan though, theme wise he seems to fit better and I think he adds more than giving one unit infiltrate, of course then you might find your Termies chasing shadows all game though, so I guess it needs testing

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